Rugby videos of tackles, tries, funny incidents and more: Jocelino Suta red card for shoulder charge on Remy Martin

Friday, January 07, 2011

Jocelino Suta red card for shoulder charge on Remy Martin

It's been a controversial week for rugby in the UK and France as a handful of incidents have resulted in suspensions. Here's a quick clip of one that took place in the Top 14, when Toulon met Bayonne last week.

Toulon lock Joss Suta made this horrible looking hit on Remy Martin as his side went down 20-9 in what was a disastrous game for the big spending team. Suta was shown a straight red, leaving his team to play the remainder of the game with just fourteen men. Martin left the field shortly after the dangerous hit.

The referee's handling of the game came into question though as Toulon coach Phillipe Saint Andre was frustrated with the way the match was handled at times.

"Bayonne should be congratulated for winning a game one try to zero against fourteen players. You're always going to be chasing the game when that happens," he said.

Suta was cited and will appear before a Disciplinary Committee on January 19. He is suspended from playing pending the decision of that hearing.

Time: 0:46

I can't believe an islander made an illegal hit. Shocking!

By ReactorField, at January 07, 2011 4:24 pm
is that a red card offence?

By Anonymous, at January 07, 2011 4:32 pm
Ouch, looked nasty.

Martin is tough but not many would last long after that

By Laz, at January 07, 2011 4:34 pm
Red Card for what?!! What a Pu$$y!

By Anonymous, at January 07, 2011 4:42 pm
Looked awful. ^^ would you have absorbed that impact without much trouble then, Anon? Wow, that's really impressive.

By Phil, at January 07, 2011 4:46 pm
Definite Red Card. Shoulder in the face. He put Martin off the pitch through foul play, so deserves the red in my view.

By Admin, at January 07, 2011 4:47 pm
Definite Red Card. Shoulder in the face. He put Martin off the pitch through foul play, so deserves the red in my view.

By Admin, at January 07, 2011 4:47 pm
ReactorField, he's a french islander, it's even worse :D

I don't think he made this on purpose, but it's horrible how the head is smashed up!

By Grumly, at January 07, 2011 4:47 pm
Its funny how Martin reacts to the handshake in the hand ahahah NOPE ahahaha

By Anonymous, at January 07, 2011 4:57 pm
I don't think this is red card worthy. Sure the hit was bad, but he crouched into the tackle a bit. Yellow card for the shoulder and not wrapping the arms, but not a red. Also, blondey refusing to accept the handshake makes him seem like a bit of a dick.

By Ed, at January 07, 2011 5:02 pm
I have to agree with the carding… he was the second man in, and shouldered the runner in the face with no attempt to wrap. We'd have the NFL's problems with concussions if we let this happen too much.

By Anonymous, at January 07, 2011 5:02 pm
An Islander making an illegal hit? It's funny because nobody ever notices what whitey does... look at the RD page right now... 2 white guys scrapping (it's usually white guys in these stupid fights)... a white guy kicking another in the face (it's usually white guys doing these dirty things, eye gouging, cheap punches, etc.)... a fat white guy killing the ball (it's usually white guy's slowing the ball down, handling in the ruck, etc.) after a pretty average tackle.

There's also an islander putting in a great hit (with Earls) and an Islander finishing off a great try... whenever an Islander does a good thing, nobody says anything, when an Islander does a bad thing, everyone jumps on the bandwagon. When a white guy does a bad thing, nobody says anything about race even though the white guys always do the same stuff.

Hypocrites.

By Maui, at January 07, 2011 5:07 pm
This comment has been removed by the author.

By Albert Fish, at January 07, 2011 5:08 pm
Probably not a cognac man!

By Anonymous, at January 07, 2011 5:44 pm
"I can't believe an islander made an illegal hit. Shocking!"

OMG - another racist commenter on rugbydump. Shocking!

By putain, at January 07, 2011 6:07 pm
^^cannot handle the banter

By bruce, at January 07, 2011 6:19 pm
ahaha big old lame Martin refusing to shake hands .... last time I saw that it was JB Elissalde after Martin stomped him on the chest.
And he talked about fair-play and all... well the video sums the whole thing up !

By jay, at January 07, 2011 6:20 pm
Islander this, whitey that... Give us a break and judge an action by what it is.
Sarcastic congrats to the trolls always managing to put everybody on the same old tracks.
Good action = good player. Bad action = bad player. Sad action = well, unlucky player. Full stop.

Red card is totally understandable, even if debatable.

By GingerIslander, at January 07, 2011 6:20 pm
I think everyone would agree that the big hit is part of most Polynesian players' games and when they get it right its pretty impressive/scary.

Having played in New Zealand and against all 3 Pacific Island teams at age grade I would have to slightly agree with the Islander generalisation...

There are too many high/no arm tackles which are just an attempt to cause as much damage as possible to the opponent outside the laws of the game - in the same way as a punch/stamp.

This hit in particular comes across as quite cowardly with suta putting a head high shot in without using his arms against an already tackled opponent. I don't blame Remy for refusing the handshake.

Just my opinion though!

By Gilberto, at January 07, 2011 6:29 pm
completely agree Maui, yes some of its banter but a lot of the time its just people jumping on the band wagon, so basically its shanter = shit banter

By Anonymous, at January 07, 2011 6:48 pm
an also, following on from my shanter comment, i dont think the hit is as bad as it looks, the islander is already committed to the tackle but the 'white dick who is unsportsmanlike' is being tackled an brought down at the same time so is in affect ducking into the tackle

By Anonymous, at January 07, 2011 6:50 pm
the fact that he got sent off doesn't make anyone a pussy, that's just stupid. A team mate of mine was paralysed with a far softer hit than that. Players need to be responsibile given that they are proffessionals

By Anonymous, at January 07, 2011 7:20 pm
There's been more injuries from scrums and I see know calls from rugby fans to cut them out of the game.

By Anonymous, at January 07, 2011 7:22 pm
white people have killing the ball, handling in the ruck, cheap shots, stupid fights (i dont mind a fight but some stuff you guys fight over is retarded), kicks to the face, stamping, eye gouging, stuff like that. its all much more common among non-islanders.

islanders have big hits.sometimes illegal, generally not. we may hit big and sometimes outside the laws of the game but better that than all the shite i listed in the first paragraph. no cheap bitchy, stuff.

its funny hw people criticize the Islanders and not a word is said about anyone else... it's a shame that Islanders are the minority particularly on this site. If they weren't they wouldn't get so much shit (or at least other people would get the shit they deserve). completely agrree with maui (a fellow islander)

By ty, at January 07, 2011 7:31 pm
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

By ty, at January 07, 2011 7:32 pm
nice one mate... real mature. please delete that one admin. thank you

i've got nothing against white people. i just dont like islanders being unfairly critisized. or critisized so bialy

By ty, at January 07, 2011 7:34 pm
Everybody is an islander !!!
Some Islands are bigger than others but still.

By Grumly, at January 07, 2011 7:39 pm
We aren't talking about Pacific Islanders numbnuts.

By Anonymous, at January 07, 2011 8:55 pm
Islanders are best because we have to resort to big, illegal hits to make us look like we're good at rugby.

By ty, at January 07, 2011 10:25 pm
Unlucky to get red. 2nd man into the tackle should always be a little bit careful.

By aaaaaa, at January 07, 2011 11:37 pm
Not me ^^^

Besides, we're good at big hits. Look at Lomu. He ran through whole teams hahaha.

As I said, it's better than all the other shit non-islanders do (listed above). No surprise that nobody denies it.

By ty, at January 07, 2011 11:53 pm
RUGBYDUMP Admin. We are straying from critiquing the game in these comments. Please police this site more carefully. As for the hit, the idea that he "ducked" into the shoulder is a laugh. As one Anony stated, these guys are professional and therefore responsible for their actions. The is an NH game so play by the NH rules. SH have different techniques, so be it. Leave the non-rugby comments out of the discussion.

By Anonymous, at January 08, 2011 1:08 am
in our wonderful and physical game things happen in split seconds!!

To reject the hand of a player (a very tall player) who has made an an accidently high hit on you is bad form!! FACT!!

It was premeditated or vindictive, just unlucky! Martin comes across far worse in this for me! I have only experienced such a lack of sportsmanship and gentlemanly spirit when playing against welsh universities, namely UWIC!!

By Top Shagger, at January 08, 2011 1:50 am
wasn't*

By Top Shagger, at January 08, 2011 1:51 am
not shaking hands isnt in the gentlemans code which is rugby! Things happen in a split second in our wonderful yet physical game, if a man tries to apologise, it should be accepted unless vindictive and premeditated (gouging)!!

Martin comes off far worse in this vid for me, childish player who took an accidental high hit, from a very tall player, like it was personal! Bad form!

By Top Shagger, at January 08, 2011 1:53 am
Ty, I urge you to please take back your comments. This is NOT a race issue. Rugby is a game that has grown organically over the last century, and every nationality has put their own character into it. The french are reowned for foul play - due to the growth of the game in the tough south-west of France. The English are typically in the search of control of the game. The islanders play tough, hard and fast. It has nothing to do with race - it is to do with local rugby culture, and the way one plays the game from the age of 5 upwards. Regardless of these differences, the rules remain the same worldwide - illegal tackle - borderline red/yellow card regardless of nationlity.

I would never want the islanders to play any other way - nor would i want England to play any other way. These differences are part of what makes rugby a great game - so let's forget about race and concentrate on the game!

By Anonymous, at January 08, 2011 2:07 am
For all the comments on this being accidental - anyone who has played the game knows that there is nothing accidental about this incident - let's refer to it as deliberate laziness...? Oh - I'll just leave my shoulder in the way of his head...

The simple fact is that he could/should have moved his shoulder out of the way of his falling head and didn't because he figured it would at least leave him groggy for a few minutes. I get that - have done it myself - but you cannot complain when afterwards someone "misinturprets" your "laziness" for intent to injury a fellow player.

By Anonymous, at January 08, 2011 2:10 am
How could I take back my comments?

anyway, i did not bring it up and i never have previously. i rarely even respond. but islanders get so much shit, unjustly. people are so hypocritical about complaining about islanders.

you should explain this to all the others.

and how come you address this to me only? the race issue was not brought up by me and it is always brought up by non-islanders.

next time there is a cheap shot, boot to the face, slowing the ball, etc. i'll point out the fact that it's usually a whitey

By ty, at January 08, 2011 2:28 am
All I'm going to say is NH rugby is an absolute disgrace.

You guys are setting these ridiculous precedents for the rest of the world with the soft calls then backing them up with the outright racist comments regarding Islanders yet you praise them up North in club rugby.

Jokers.

By Anonymous, at January 08, 2011 5:50 am
well said maui

By Enough, at January 08, 2011 10:29 am
"All I'm going to say is NH rugby is an absolute disgrace.

You guys are setting these ridiculous precedents for the rest of the world with the soft calls then backing them up with the outright racist comments regarding Islanders yet you praise them up North in club rugby.

Jokers."

NZ are the only decent SH team. SA are shite. They had the easiest route to the RWC I've ever seen hahahaha and Australia can't even beat Ireland who are shit. in fact, didn't they get beaten by scotland a while ago? hahaha and scotland even beat sa. scotland are fucking shit.

By Anonymous, at January 08, 2011 12:17 pm
Now that I've seen the proof, I apologise for my fellow Islanders. I'm sorry.

HeavenlyDivine - Representing every single Islander in the World.

By HeavenlyDivine, at January 08, 2011 3:53 pm
"We'd have the NFL's problems with concussions if we let this happen too much."

Pro-Rugby has more concussions than the NFL already.

The people who control the NFL want to ruin the game. Most NFL fans and players don't like the new rules being put forward.

Lets remember both sports are voluntary. Concussions are part and parcel of the game. Players don't care. It's only the Mummies at home who are bothered.

By Chris, at January 08, 2011 3:55 pm
I have to agree with maui. The fighting, eye gouging cheating is universal and more often than not involves a white player, prob because there are more white players than any other..erm what's the right word? colour?. But i'd say there are alot of bad tackles made by islanders, especially considering they are a minority. I don't think they are dirty players I would say it's their style of play. They like to go high as it a) prevents offloads b) is where the biggest contact is c) potential for turnover etc. To win these type of tackles you need to hit the ball carrier extremely hard. This means charging into the tackle and committing yourself. There is therefore much more of a chance to get it wrong. My opinion anyway. So not dirty just big tacklers. If it goes wrong then you get punished as it can be dangerous. If you get it right then you have a big tackle, stops attacks, maybe turnover and inspires your team around you.

peace

By Jedi, at January 08, 2011 5:52 pm
btw let's take a little perspective, the hit on thom evans is ridiculous compared to this one (and/or many high tackles). He even kinda ducked into the tackle. and i reckon there was no islander involved.

so what do we think of all that now?

By Mummy at home, at January 08, 2011 7:45 pm
It definitely looked like a red card offence, no one can deny it. Suta's tackle was not harmless, dangerously made, but not on purpose.
Martin's was knocked out, his reaction was a bit childish but I can understand. He really is a tough man, I think going out after a being tackled really hurt his pride.

I am from "tough Southwest France" and -you would be surprised- we do not eat our kids, we do not beat our wives, we do not fight with our neighbours every week. I suppose that all pacific islanders do not do war dances, eat coconut and tackle the neck when they play rugby.
By the way, Suta (who is French) only played one year in New Caledonia (he started playing rugby when he was 18) before moving to France. So his rugby culture is by far more the one of the regular French player than of the terrible "pacific islander" people speak about on English speaking rugby forums...
I love you all anyway, please have a look at Toulon vs Racing metro tomorrow night, I bet we'll see some nice hits.

By Anonymous, at January 08, 2011 8:43 pm
I don't see what the big deal is with people commenting on islanders making illegal hits.....

Come on, a few years ago it was French club rugby that could go a game without fighting..... Then we have the safes who let's face it, even in their 'greatness' thy might be one of the dirtiest team out there...which I applaud because generally it's physical play rather than illegal but generally they have been in the limelight for more grubby play than other teams.....

And then islanders in all their physical prowness, ability, strength and skill are renowned for making illegal 'no arm tackles.' it's bit a bigoted racist remark....it's fact...RD provided the evidence over the last few years....

By Vin, at January 08, 2011 10:45 pm
Sorry but European club rugby is just plain soft for carding, even penalising stuff like this.
Unbelievable.

By Jono, at January 09, 2011 5:42 am
Under the laws of rugby union, this tackle merits a card of some description. Fact. There was no attempt to use the arms, making it a shoulder charge, which is illegal.

It was poor form from Martin to not shake Suta's hand after the incident.

BUT. In rugby league, this kind of tackle is legal. And while it doesn't happen that often, it's still a part of the game, and RL doesn't seem to suffer for it. I don't see any reason why it should be illegal in union.

By Anonymous, at January 09, 2011 11:58 am
This tackle is legal in league and league doesn't suffer from it for a reason. In league you t duck into the tackle as much as people tend to smack you in the face if you do so.

In other words because this type of tackle is legal and you cant have the ball ripped off by more than one person people tend to run more with their heads up and lead with the chest more

By Anonymous, at January 09, 2011 3:36 pm
Last time I checked a shoulder to the head was still illegal in league......so maybe check your facts before trolling....

Martin is no actor, this obviously injured him so to say something stupid like 'it happens and league and no one gets injured' perhaps just sums up what is inside most league players heads.....

And just for the record 'it happened in union in this video RIGHT HERE and there was a player injured'

Also Jono care to explain how the NH is soft in awarding cards when both NH and SH are governed by the same body?

By Vin, at January 09, 2011 10:00 pm
My comment was only meant to inform as too some of the reasons why the rule is in effect in union and yes a shoulder to the head is illegal in league but most of the time the guy wouldn't duck and also it gets missed a lot in league.

Ive seen friends knocked out and been shouldered in the face myself and heard nothing other than a shout of held.

By Anonymous, at January 10, 2011 12:45 am
Anonymous said...Ty, I urge you to please take back your comments.

Anon, I think you are basing your post on Ty @10:25 which is obviously not Ty but a troll. In his real comments Ty seems to mostly agree with you.

By DanT, at January 10, 2011 1:41 am
Anonymous league and union as you're no doubt aware are entirely different games, although I play union I have dabbled in some league over summer times and its an entirely different action.... In union you sacrifice those extra few feet in order to keep the ball safely on your side hence why you see players keeping their heads low....in league the ball is automatically yours, there for you can stretch as far as you wish and not risk losing it at a ruck.... And having a limited number of tackles the offload can generally be the better option....

So as they are entirely different games I fun it odd how you can bounce one scenario off another.... As the person above you said, this video is a clear indication of why a shoulder tackle to the head, or just a plain uncontrolled shoulder is 'dangerous.'

Ofcourse 9/10 it will probably result in no injury whatsoever, HOWEVER considering the game is a risky one anyway (see the tackle on Thom Evans) it seems clever enough to try an limit injury through this kind of uncontrolled attempt when it is perfectly reasonable to stick your shoulder in the guys chests as you wrap your arms and still produce (in my eyes) a greater tackle!

By (u-p)rick, at January 10, 2011 2:23 am
to my undestanding as an island boy that loves to play rugby and play hard ,,,that was high tackle ,stop the racist comments from both coloured or non ,,lets comment on the play not the race or whatever bs ,,its rugby!!!!!!

By Anonymous, at January 10, 2011 7:32 am
In all honesty, any 'islander' who takes offence at these comments is just playing the race card, I don't believe anyone here is intending on promoting or behaving in a racist manner, they are merely stating what appears to be a common pattern, (whether acceptable or not.)

Yes 'white' guys appear to make these tackles also, but it is common practice for an islander to make a big hit, and many times as we have seen through RD videos time and time again these have been illegal.....

So you do the math...

By Sam, at January 10, 2011 11:56 am
This would almost certainly not be a red card in any SH club or provincial championship. No way in the world.
Inf act I'd be chocked if it was regarded as anything more than a good tackle.
It would probably not be considered illegal at all.
Maybe considered a bit high (though I don't think it's really a high hit at all, maybe clipped him a bit), but that'd just be a penalty.
There are different standards in the south and the north, and from what I can see what's considered a good strong hit in the south is often a potential card or penalty in northern club compeitions, especially with French refs it seems.
Maybe it's the influence of soccer in the north and the obsession with cards in that game? I don't know.

BTW, this kind of hit happens all the time in league, and would always be regarded as simply good defence.

By Jono, at January 11, 2011 12:34 am
Great hit, love that shit.

;-)

By Anonymous, at January 11, 2011 6:21 am
Either someone is trolling jono's name or he is an idiot.... Having grown upon the SH and learnt to play rugby there as well as a regular 'watcher' of both league and union I can tell youa shoulder to the head in either sport and either hemisphere is NOT acceptable, if you argue that this would not be a penalty, then if that were actually the case, I would suggest that referees in the SH should get some specs!!!!

Maybe NH refs are more card happy however I have seen cards go to SH players by SH refs for very weak offences, however this is nothing to do with the players, it is to dowith consistency of the governing bodies....

So Jono don't be such a tool

By Sam, at January 11, 2011 3:34 pm
I love to eat poo

By Jono, at January 11, 2011 8:58 pm
Excellent, means he can't play against Munster who taught these mercenaries that Rugby is not about the wages you get.
Nasty intentional manoeuvre by Suta deserved a card and a ban as does P. Sainte Andre for his comments.

By Anonymous, at January 12, 2011 11:04 am
Well done!

Remy Martin does this often, so now he had a little of his poison!

Once again, well done!

By Anonymous, at January 12, 2011 6:24 pm
well done SAM ...making generalizations....you must be small dicked white man...see what i did there.

By Anonymous, at January 14, 2011 10:37 am